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inquisitor (Offline)
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Default 20-09-2008, 17:47

Remembering my first days of mobile telephony back in 1995, when my Nokia 2148 (aka E-Plus PT-11) was the only GSM1800 phone to support SMS and when SMS was completley unknown and completely free, I became opposed to SMS very soon, when operators started charging it. Against the background of SMS being an incidently emerged by-product, that is realized through control channles at no extra cost for the operator, I reduced SMS-communication when voice-tariffs came down and I realized calling is mostly cheaper and more effective than exchanging a couple of texts.
IM is a very interesting thing, not only because of the costs, but also because the interoperatbility with computers. But only as long as operators don't block IM-services, like those wankers recently started to do over here. They obviously will do everything to prevent becoming sole so-called "bitpipe-providers", including developing their own IM-service by a GSMA-initiative in order to replace SMS and to bill us for every bit transmitted. VoIP has been blocked here, too. So as long as VPN is not blocked yet, we need to tunnel our communication to some VPN-gateway and that only few people will be able to do.


terminals: Samsung: Galaxy S5 DuoS (G900FD); BLU: Win HD LTE; Nokia: 1200; Asus: Fonepad 7 ME372CG; Huawei data: E3372, Vodafone R201, K3765, E1762;
postpaid: O2 on Business XL; prepaid: DE: Aldi Talk, Lidl; UK: 3; BG: MTel, vivacom; RU: MTS; RS: MTS; UAE: du Tourist SIM; INT'L: toggle mobile
VoIP: sipgate.de (German DID); sipgate.co.uk (British DID); ukddi.com (British DID); sipcall.ch (Swiss DID); megafon.bg (Bulgarian DID); InterVoip.com
   
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Effendi (Offline)
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Default 21-09-2008, 12:36

In Europe people LOVE sms much more than in the Americas. That's the big difference. SMS have entered our lives so deeply that now it's really hard to change habit. And of course that's much higher among young people, i.e. the future generations. Operators do know it and they get really A LOT of money from SMS which cost them nearly nothing.


Working Prepaids: IT: Wind, Vodafone IT, UNO Mobile; SM: Prima; UK: 3, Virgin; INT: TravelSIM, Truphone.
Deceased Prepaids: CZ: Oskar, Eurotel; SK: Orange; DE: E-Plus, Aldi, Simyo; GE: Geocell; AM: Armentel; PL: Heyah, Plus; LT: Tele2; LV: Amigo; EE: Elisa; UA: Kyivstar; NZ: Vodafone; INT: UM, UM+, ICQSim.
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fedeprovenza (Offline)
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Default 21-09-2008, 12:52

Quote:
Originally Posted by inquisitor View Post
Remembering my first days of mobile telephony back in 1995, when my Nokia 2148 (aka E-Plus PT-11) was the only GSM1800 phone to support SMS and when SMS was completley unknown and completely free, I became opposed to SMS very soon, when operators started charging it. Against the background of SMS being an incidently emerged by-product, that is realized through control channles at no extra cost for the operator, I reduced SMS-communication when voice-tariffs came down and I realized calling is mostly cheaper and more effective than exchanging a couple of texts.
IM is a very interesting thing, not only because of the costs, but also because the interoperatbility with computers. But only as long as operators don't block IM-services, like those wankers recently started to do over here. They obviously will do everything to prevent becoming sole so-called "bitpipe-providers", including developing their own IM-service by a GSMA-initiative in order to replace SMS and to bill us for every bit transmitted. VoIP has been blocked here, too. So as long as VPN is not blocked yet, we need to tunnel our communication to some VPN-gateway and that only few people will be able to do.
me too, i remember when, in 1997, i've bought my first cell (an Ericcson): it was a great descover to send sms
I think it's correct EU decision, operators have a lot of gain about them and it's wrong


[COLOR="Magenta"]"Working" PrePaids: Wind, Vodafone, CoopVoce, , Travelsim (2), 02 Irish (2)
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Default 21-09-2008, 14:06

Quote:
Originally Posted by Effendi View Post
In Europe people LOVE sms much more than in the Americas. That's the big difference. SMS have entered our lives so deeply that now it's really hard to change habit. And of course that's much higher among young people, i.e. the future generations. Operators do know it and they get really A LOT of money from SMS which cost them nearly nothing.
For the first 5 or 6 years of digital cellular in the US texting was not a big deal. I'd say most American customers had no idea how to send a text and some didn't even know how to read one if they received it. There are a number of reasons for this:
1. Because we pay for incoming calls Americans didn't give out their cellular numbers to just everyone. It was almost impolite to ask someone for his cellular number; sort of like asking for the combination to open their post office box.
2. Analog service hung around for a long time and you couldn't be sure if the other party could actually receive your text or not.
3. Similarly, the text systems between the various carriers were not well connected. GSM worked pretty well but you could not exchange texts with customers on CDMA and TDMA systems. Often customers on one TDMA system could not send a test to another TDMA carrier.
4. The competition was all over voice minutes. Folks could buy these huge buckets of voice minutes, like 3000 minutes for $50, but text was still 15c each. Why send a text for 15c when you can talk 9 minutes for the same price?

In my area this situation continued up until Hurricane Katrina (Aug 2005) damaged and overloaded most of the communications system. People who knew how to use text found that it would still work when voice would not. Since then many more people around here know how to use text, even if they don't do so regularly.

Young people tend to use text even when it's not the most cost-effective method. They are the reason that carriers now offer large text bucket bolt-ons for voice plans.
   
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inquisitor (Offline)
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Default 22-04-2009, 13:56

The discussed cuts of roaming tariffs is definitely becoming reality after the EU Parliament has approved the bill:
European Parliament Votes to Approve Cuts on Roaming Charges

Besides the cut in SMS-prices from July roaming calls within the EU will be billed by the second after the 30th second.

Meanwhile I wonder how the wholesale-cap of data prices will affect consumer tariffs.


terminals: Samsung: Galaxy S5 DuoS (G900FD); BLU: Win HD LTE; Nokia: 1200; Asus: Fonepad 7 ME372CG; Huawei data: E3372, Vodafone R201, K3765, E1762;
postpaid: O2 on Business XL; prepaid: DE: Aldi Talk, Lidl; UK: 3; BG: MTel, vivacom; RU: MTS; RS: MTS; UAE: du Tourist SIM; INT'L: toggle mobile
VoIP: sipgate.de (German DID); sipgate.co.uk (British DID); ukddi.com (British DID); sipcall.ch (Swiss DID); megafon.bg (Bulgarian DID); InterVoip.com
   
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Default 22-04-2009, 14:46

I believe, and the many Europeans here can correct me if I'm wrong, the ultimate purpose of all this is to turn the eu into something akin to the USA with the various countries playing the role the various state do in the USA. It seems to be Redding's plan to eventually have no roaming charges throughout and within the eu.

If that comes to pass, it will certainly pretty much be the death of most of the international cards as Europeans would simply not need them. What would be the market? Americans? And basically if an American were travelling to Europe, all he or she would need is the cheapest PAYG card available. As the majority of my travelling is to Europe, I am beginning to question whether I really need to keep buying recharge vouchers to keep the sim cards I acquired earlier from France, Holland, Germany, Italy and Ireland. The Dutch one began to have a very limited shelf life, they have just deactivfated my German one, I'll be doing a three week tour of France and have been assiduosly acquired 10¢ top ups to keep that card alive, my Italy card is scheduled to expire in June. Perhaps with the current tariff situation I can make do with a free O2-UK card and as it stands now, use their european roaming tariffs (the key one is receiving at 18p/minute) calling back to the USA is expensive outside the UK of course but maybe a local ld card with a local number with resolve that issue at what is the rate for calls within Europe, 35p (especially since the UK£ has plunged to just about $1.45 US)....and of course if Redding has her way, reception will eventually be free and something like 15p/minute.

Now if only carriers such as T Mobile USA and AT&T would see the light and give even moderately fair rates on international roaming.
   
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Default 22-04-2009, 15:59

Quote:
Originally Posted by MATHA531 View Post
Perhaps with the current tariff situation I can make do with a free O2-UK card and as it stands now, use their european roaming tariffs (the key one is receiving at 18p/minute) calling back to the USA is expensive outside the UK of course ....
Depending on how much you are likely to call in a month, it can be a lot cheaper than that with a temporary subscription to o2 MyEurope Extra. This can be switched on and off for a month at a time on the prepaid o2 cards, and costs 10 pounds a month. For that it offers free incoming and slightly cheaper outgoing at 25p/min though you can also setup a callback. The subscription cost justifies itself as opposed to the roaming tarriff if you are going to be receiving more than 55 mins of calls in a month.

I have mentioned it before here, but I really can't sing it's praises enough, as it has saved me probably 1000's of euros in the last few years, and a lot of the headache that goes with the Internatioal roaming cards (which have come to light again recently with the 'possible' demise of UM). The nicest thing is that I keep the same ordinary UK mobile number that I have had for the last 10 years and never have to give out an IOM/Jersey,Lichtenstein,belgian etc. or setup a divert etc. Also unlike with other +447 numbering ranges (IOM, Jersey etc.) friends from the UK on any network never get nasty bill surprises when they call me. This used to be an issue in the past.

After more than a few dabbles with international roaming cards, I basically gave up on pretty much all of them about two and half years ago, after o2 UK kindly gave me a free subscription (on my postpay account) to MyEurope Extra. I still have a few other international cards for travel outside Europe (e.g. eKit, Maxroam), but they see limited use these days for the countries I end up visiting.
   
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Lucy (Offline)
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Default 01-07-2009, 15:33

BBC on new EU mobile phone costs

Cost of texting abroad comes down
Mobile phone
Roaming text charges have not been capped in the EU before

The cost of sending text messages from your mobile phone when you are overseas in the European Union has come down.

The maximum charge for sending a text is now 11 euro cents ($0.15; 9.4p) plus sales tax.

It is the first time that text charges have been capped. The previous EU average was 28 cents.

The price of making a call is capped at 43 cents a minute, down from 46 cents, while the price of receiving a call is capped at 19 cents, down from 22 cents.

"The roaming-rip off is now coming to an end," said EU Telecoms Commissioner Viviane Reding.

The cost of transferring a megabyte of data is capped at one euro.

Also, mobile operators have been forced to charge for calls by the second after the first half minute, instead of rounding up to the nearest minute.
   
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wco81 (Offline)
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Default 02-07-2009, 06:00

Here's the EU page on roaming costs.

Roaming: The roaming regulation | Europa - Information Society

So how quickly will prepaid SIMs have these in effect?
   
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dg7feq (Offline)
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Default 02-07-2009, 08:30

Immideately since yesterday. All cards have to stick to the rules, no matter if contract or prepaid.

Chris


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eu commission, international roaming, viviane reding

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