http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/4696494.stm

... our friend Viviane Reding :)

I forgot to post you the document that EU Commission sent to PPGSM-> http://tinyurl.com/7hhs2 :D

I'm afraid that the link above is incorrect :(

I can correctly see the link

Maybe you don't have Adobe Reader installed?

Now if only US based carriers would take the cue and charge more reasonable rates for international roaming. :whistle:

Oh like that is going to happen. We are americans we need all the money we can get so the Big CEO can have the house in Aspen and a villa on the greek isle.

My Acrobat Reader is OK. I think there was a transfer problem yesterday. Now I can read the letter :)

Not bad... a recognition of prepaidgsm's "institutional role"! :thumbup: although they could have shown even a bit more enthousiasm for the site IMHO.

:clap:

Why? The existence of PPGSM shows that at least providing high-value infomation thanks to which many people may avoid being ripped off doesn't require spending millions of euros of taxpayers' money :whistle:

Interesting article about this in the Times of London:

http://business.timesonline.co.uk/article/...2031386,00.html

Of course what Vodafone doesn't say...they justify high roaming rates by saying they have to reimburse the operator one is roaming on...right...so if I'm in Germany with a Vodafone UK sim and roaming on Vodafone DE, Vodafone UK has to reimburse Vodafone DE and passes along the price to me.....but of course when Vodafone UK "reimburses" Vodafone DE all that is happening is the money is going from the left pocket to the right pocket, or it vice versa.

What a bunch of malarkey.

I'm nearly wetting myself laughing at some of that. Damage profitability - when was Vodafone last actually profitable? Several years ago.

The big lie is that all the companies are only passing on the charges of the foreign network. As we know, a prepaid SIM on Orange Poland calling the UK will be charged more than 3 times as much if it is British than if it is Polish.

When Orange UK 3 years ago introduced more than doubled charges in Eastern Europe, 51p to ?1.10, I asked ironically if about 50 networks in Romania, Bulgaria, Poland, and ten or so others had all presented Orange with proposed increases on the same day, and if so shouldn't Orange have complained this might be a cartel?

I recently had a chat with someone at O2, who complained that O2 Ireland's new roaming deal is already stealing O2 UK customers in Northern Ireland, less than 3 weeks after introduction. Good - then why don't they reply by spreading the free roaming to all Telefonica/O2 countries? Of course, they are probably taking customers in Northern Ireland and the border areas off the other UK and Irish networks as well, which can't do their profitablity much good then ...

I think the process has some problems on the way.

3 times you say?I think that it's worth saying here that Orange Poland prepaids are the most expensive Polish prepaid solution when calling to UK mobiles (2.89 PLN/min mobile, 2.06 PLN/min landline with 60/60 debiting). You can have UK calls for 2.00 PLN/min with 30/30 debiting in Sami Swoi and 1.70 PLN/min with 60/60 Heyah (the latter with easy option to cut the cost to 1.55 PLN/min).

As for Polish operators, I suppose that by default they charge their roaming partners with tariffs (including rates, peak hours and debiting) valid for the moment when the networks started (Plus and Era - October 1996, Idea/Orange - March 1998). An example of such roaming agreements is LuxGSM: http://www.luxgsm.lu/index.php?page=...3&pays=Pologne
I really doubt that Polish ops suddenly increased the rates for Orange UK 3 years ago. Exchange rate PLN/GBP didn't change suddenly either :).

Some more words about roaming tariffs in Poland and Orange Poland in particular.
Basically, Polish ops use in postpaid roaming a very complicated tariff system based on rates of foreign partners + 15% comission on top. Those rates depend on the current agreement with foreign partners and of course on the exchange rate (set once a month according to unclear rules :P). Until 1.05.2004 (joing the EU) Polish VAT 22% was added to the commision, now it's added to the total "foreign rate+commision" :(. It's obvious that those roaming agreements are often very "obsolete". The example: AFAIK in Belarus and Ukraine at the present time there are no national tariffs with non-free incomig calls but there are still extra charges for incoming calls in Belarus and Ukraine on top of usual rates for calls from Poland to those countries :ranting2: .
As I said in Septemeber, on rebranding from Idea Orange PL introduced a new postpaid "simple roaming tariff". It was intended to replace tariff system replaced above. They divided the world into 4 zones, decreased the rates for incoming calls and made free MMS receiving. Morever the tariff is in PLN, so it's "exchange rate risk free". The call rates for former USSR or many exotic non-European countries dropped but increased much (even 5-6 times more!) for many EU countries (where most Poles travel abroad). This roaming tariff was criticised so much and now it's possible to choose between the two tariffs ("roaming partner rate based" or "zone based"). However, it's impossible to select the better of the two possible rates - only one roaming tariff is available at the moment and it can be switched from one to another only once a month (on the day when the billing and invoice are issued).
The only real advantage of painting Idea with Orange paint and Orange "partneship" :D so far was a 2 month (Dec05/Jan06) promotion named "Orange Countries".
This promotion was valid in any network (not only Orange, but I think that thanks to automatic network selection, most users were using Orange networks anyway :)) in the following countries: Belgium, France, Spain, Holland, Portugal, Romania, Słovakia, Switzerland and UK. The advantages of the promotion were; cheaper incoming calls in Romania (2.50 vs 4.00 PLN), cheaper outgoing calls (4.00 PLN anywhere vs 5.50/8.00 Europe, 11.00 PLN elsewhere), cheaper SMSes (1 vs 1.80 PLN). Now the promotion is over and the future is bright :P.


Hmm, reunification of Ulster with the Republic is coming?
I don't want to be offensive to our British friends - it's just a politically incorrect joke :)

You mean e.g. different VAT rates?